The episode features host Keith Bilous and co-hosts Jon Anderson and Marty, along with guest Wade Channell, an expert on healthy masculinity and international development.
I. Male Contraception: A New Frontier and Shifting Responsibilities
The Announcement: The show opens with the announcement of a hormone-free male contraceptive pill, YCT-529, currently in human trials in New Zealand, boasting a 99% effectiveness rate in preclinical trials and reversible fertility within weeks of stopping.
Potential Impact: The hosts discuss the potential "game changer" this could be for relationships, allowing men to share the responsibility of contraception without hormonal side effects or permanent procedures. Keith notes, "sharing the load on contraception could change relationships overnight."
Male Agency and Protection: Jon highlights the empowering aspect for men, giving them the "ability to protect himself" in situations where partners may not be forthcoming about their contraceptive status or intentions. He shares a personal story where an unintended pregnancy led to his parents' divorce, underscoring the potential for male control in such situations.
Differing Perspectives: Marty expresses initial skepticism, jokingly referring to himself as "Pull out Pete" or "Condom Chris," indicating a current reliance on traditional methods. However, he also acknowledges the weight of responsibility on women and expresses a preference for taking a pill over a partner having an abortion: "I'd rather take the pill instead of asking her to get an abortion."
Shared Responsibility: The consensus among the hosts is positive, emphasizing the idea of shared responsibility. Keith suggests, "whether if she's on it or not on it, I'm on it too. We're both on it." They also acknowledge the continued importance of condoms for preventing STIs.
Timeliness of Choice: Jon emphasizes the broader impact of having more choices in life, stating, "the more choices a person has, the better off that, you know, their life should be."
Accountability on Both Sides: Marty stresses the need for both men and women to be accountable in sexual relationships, with men taking precautions and women not allowing unprotected sex if they don't want it.
II. Redefining Masculinity: Breaking Free from Restrictive Gender Roles
Introducing Wade Chanel: Wade Chanel, an expert with 30 years in international development and author of "To Be a Man: Rethinking Our Roles, Rules, and Relationships for a More Rewarding Life," joins the conversation. His work focuses on dismantling "masculinity myths" and redefining traditional gender roles.
Responsibility as Core: Wade immediately connects the male contraceptive discussion to responsibility, stating, "it's about one thing, responsibility. Boom. And if we are not responsible, we are not men, we're boys." He emphasizes that "men need to be men. Take responsibility for what we're doing."
Unhealthy Masculinity and its Consequences: Wade argues that "unhealthy masculinity" stemming from "cultural lies and myths" (e.g., the need to dominate and suppress emotions) is a root cause of various societal issues, including gender-based violence and inequalities. He notes, "Every statistic had one common denominator in my mind, and that was unhealthy masculinity."
The Myth of Emotional Suppression: Wade challenges the notion that men shouldn't show emotions, recounting his own experience and appreciating the hosts' previous discussion on crying. He points out the societal pressure: "a lot of guys will tell you, I can't cry. Everybody will say I'm a Ws. You know, man up. Don't be a girl."
Redefining Strength: The discussion explores a broader definition of strength beyond physical prowess, including the strength to be vulnerable and seek help. Jon states, "if a fucking man is come to a point where he truly accepts himself and he understands who he is, none of this fucking bullshit really applies."
Challenging Traditional Notions: Wade debunks the idea of a divine mandate for traditional masculinity, stating, "It ain't in there. These are socially constructed." He advocates for a masculinity based on "compassion, kindness, gentleness, patience, loving kindness, and love." He even suggests that "Mr. Macho, macho...is the ancient Spanish word for stupid."
Confidence Grounded in Reality: Wade emphasizes that "Confidence gotta be based reality."
Influence of Fatherhood: The hosts, all fathers (including a grandfather in Wade), discuss how raising daughters has influenced their perspectives on gender roles and the importance of showing vulnerability and challenging stereotypes for their children. Keith emphasizes the bond created when engaging in activities traditionally seen as feminine with their daughters.
Breaking Societal "Rules": Jon offers a powerful analogy: "Break the rules, not the laws." He encourages listeners to challenge societal expectations while respecting legal boundaries.
The Importance of Therapy: Wade openly discusses the benefits of therapy for men, challenging the stigma associated with seeking help for emotional well-being. He recounts his own positive experiences, stating, "I bought myself a friend called a therapist. Yes. Loved it. Changed my life." Keith echoes this, calling their show "therapy in the lab."
Sex as a Privilege, Not a Right: Wade shares a thought-provoking perspective: "Sex with another person is always a privilege, only a privilege, never a right."
III. Deleting Social Media Apps: A Personal Anecdote (Briefly Mentioned)
Keith's Experience: Keith mentions at the beginning of the show that he deleted social media apps a few years prior and will share his experience, comparing it to a "modern day fasting without the hunger pangs" and "absolutely refreshing."
Becoming a "Ghost": He states that after deleting the apps, he "became a ghost," and it wasn't just his battery life that improved.
Deferred Discussion: Due to the engaging conversations on male contraception and masculinity, Keith's personal story about deleting social media is briefly introduced but ultimately deferred to the end of the show with limited detail provided in these excerpts.
Quotes:
Keith: "I deleted social media apps. I'm gonna tell you all about it, which feels like a modern day fasting without the hunger pangs. Honestly, it's absolutely refreshing."
Jon: "I think what it, what I really enjoy, I, what I think is powerful about this is it gives the male the ability to protect himself." (on the male pill)
Marty: "I'd rather take the pill instead of asking her to get an abortion."
Wade: "it's about one thing, responsibility. Boom. And if we are not responsible, we are not men, we're boys."
Wade: "Every statistic had one common denominator in my mind, and that was unhealthy masculinity."
Jon: "I'm a fucking woman trapped in a man's body. If you don't like it, dislike it from over there."
Jon: "Break the rules, not the laws."
Wade: "I bought myself a friend called a therapist. Yes. Loved it. Changed my life."
Wade: "Sex with another person is always a privilege, only a privilege, never a right."
Wade: "One word to describe traditional masculinity: Constrained."
Wade: "If you could instantly redefine one aspect of masculinity for every man on the planet, what would it be and why? Emotional health."
Key Facts and Ideas:
A hormone-free male contraceptive pill (YCT-529) is undergoing human trials with promising preclinical results.
This development has the potential to significantly shift the landscape of contraception and shared responsibility in relationships.
Traditional notions of masculinity are being challenged as potentially harmful and limiting.
Healthy masculinity encompasses responsibility, emotional intelligence, vulnerability, and kindness.
Seeking therapy is presented as a sign of strength and a valuable tool for men's well-being.
Sex with another person should be viewed as a privilege based on mutual consent, not an inherent right.
Deleting social media can lead to a sense of refreshment and liberation.
Potential Discussion Points:
The societal implications and potential challenges of widespread adoption of a male contraceptive pill.
Strategies for promoting healthier and more inclusive definitions of masculinity.
Overcoming the stigma associated with men seeking help for mental and emotional health.
The importance of open and honest communication in relationships regarding contraception and expectations around gender roles.
Personal experiences and benefits of taking breaks from or deleting social media.
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